- Npos_2018 - lists.testbiotech.de

another highly relevant document
by Christoph Then 04 Feb '21

04 Feb '21

Dear all this the follow up to my previous mail. it concerns a document prepared for patent law committee last year (CA/PL 4/20, see attached in German and English). some findings from quick reading: paras 28-32 deal with random mutations. our analysis is mentioned (however, again no difference is made between trait and and any genetic alterations). its is confirmed that patent on random mutations get granted. To me the content of Para 31 was new: It is stated that G3/19 is confirming the need for patents on radiated plants (however radiation is definitely not the method you will use to directly derive to a new trait). This means, we have to take into account that G3/19 adds to the documents with presenting wrong interpretations of G2/07 and G1/08. This makes our standing more complicated. In para 35-37 it seems they agree with us that living cells are not patentable if derived from relevant plants or animals. thus this problem seems to be solved to some extent: To my understanding this document is sufficient to clarify the issue which was confused by the former President. We might take as a success. In Para 38-42 it is announced that staying for 310 patent applications, 10 oppositions and 18 appeals are lifted. Summary: We should continue to explain the difference between traits and other genetic changes (which need crossing and selection). Since this difference was not considered so far, it might still be relevant for future interpretation. A lot of work still to do. We might spend less emphasis on patentability of cells. We have to continue to work on scope of patents (the disclaimer solution is also mentioned in this document, para 26/27 but without need for further discussion). I will continue reading and maybe send a third document. cheers Christoph

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another very important document: New Guidance for examination
by Christoph Then 03 Feb '21

03 Feb '21

Dear all thanks to Johanna we were also made aware that the new examination guidance is online: with track changes: https://www.epo.org/law-practice/legal-texts/guidelines/guidelines-preview.… final: https://www.epo.org/law-practice/legal-texts/guidelines.html general overview: https://www.epo.org/law-practice/legal-texts/official-journal/2021/01/a6.ht… I attach the relevant chapter on patentability with track changes (I guess no German version is available). it is made clear that rule 28(2) has not be applied to applications filed before July 2017. in this context, also the role of the disclaimer is defined in more detail. !! on page 51 random mutations are considered: an very lousy example for patentable inventions was deleted. Very good. Further clarification was added: A mutant of a plant carrying a heritable exchange in a nucleotide sequence effected by technical means, e.g. UV mutagenesis or CRISPR/Cas *with the proviso that the plant is not exclusively obtained** **by means of an essentially biological process (EBP).* the second part (now added) of the sentence means that even it mutagenesis is applied, the plant still might be derived from essentially biological processes. This could mean that the patent applicant has to show that the claims are in accordance with G2/07 and G1/08 (direct insertion of a trait) and it is not enough to show that mutagenesis was applied. To further discuss this issue I would like to give two examples: in the case of herbicide resistant plants derived from random mutations it might be sufficient to treat them with the herbicide to identify the desired traits (patentable) in case of plants with resistant to downy mildew it might be necessary to perform (after mutatgenesis) further crossing and selection to derive to the desired (quantitative) trait. These examples show how these new guidance might become applied. this would mean a step ahead: So far, each application of mutagenesis was sufficient to overcome rule 28 (2). Now only some plants might escape. But still not all methods for conventional breeding would be excluded. There is another possibility how this additional half sentence might be used (and made worthless): The EPO could decide to simply demand a disclaimer, leaving it completely open what exactly is patentable or excluded. !! on page 52, living cells are excluded if derived from relevant plants or animals - this seems to a success of our work. Summary: Some progress was made. It is hard to say if we have chances to reach better decisions by the Admin Council if we follow our current approach. The alternative would be to say: We now see that based on latest documents, final clarity only can be achieved by a change of law. This also might mean we still could use patents as granted before July 2017 to raise pressure - the debate would no longer just concern rule 28(2). This also might help to move ahead the Admin Council to provide further clarifications. We have to discuss this next week during our phone call. I also will continue to think about and might have improved analysis next week. cheers Christoph

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technical / legal issues some more relevant documents on current decision making of the EPO
by Christoph Then 03 Feb '21

03 Feb '21

Dear all Johanna identified several interesting documents on the website of the EPO which I would like to share. I am just about to read and to try give first short analysis in several steps. The first document (CA/PL 4/17, attached in de and en) is another preparatory document for the decision of the Administrative Council in 2017. It was adopted by patent law Committee in March 2017 (CA/PL 4/17) and then was use by the President to file his document in June (CA/56/17 - this the document we quoted from in our legal analysis). In its paragraphs 6, 73-76 and 82 & 83 it deals with patentability of random mutagenesis. It explains the issue which the was repeated and summarized by the CA/56/17 document. For my understanding paragraphs 82 &83 are problematic because they mix up trait (G2/07 & G2/08) with any genetic alteration. To me it seems (after quick reading) our analysis is correct and this document is some proof that G2/07 and G1/08 are not correctly interpreted. Further in paragraphs 88-91 it deals with patentability of cells. To me it looks like they only wanted to allow patents on processed products (such as meal and sugar) but not on cells for further regeneration. Thus, to me it looks like we are right in stating that document CA/56/17 should become more precise, since it includes patentability of living cells. It is interesting that in Para 101 & 102 they are also discussing about the possibility to define essentially biological processes. I will do further reading and in case send further docs I guess this material is relevant for our report and we should have a proper understanding. Cheers Christoph

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IMPORTANT: Conference Call 9 February 2021 - Agenda
by Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org 03 Feb '21

03 Feb '21

Dear all, please find below the draft agenda for our conference call next week. Best, Johanna --- 1. Updates 1.1. Updates from the countries / organisations 2. Next steps / Strategy 2.1. Report 2021 2.2. Meeting with EPO beginning of March 2.3. Public activity for Admin. Council (23 March)? § Produce more sculptures of the screaming vegetables? 3. Other 3.1. Email communication / labels Proposal: Label Content such as Important - Information in regards to the Meeting of Members (date, documents, preparation) - Information in regard to Conference calls (date, agenda, minutes) - Information about a planned press release, taking quotes - Decisions that have to be taken / Feedback needed no label - drafts and edits of press releases and reports - details of planned activities - updates, news on patent issues 3.2. Communication between German and English speaking members § Translation for Meeting of Members? § Coordination between conference calls in English / German 3.3. Next conference call Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 1:35 PM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de Subject: [Npos_2018] IMPORTANT: Conference Call 9 February 2021 Dear all, thank you for filling in the doodle. Our next conference call will be on Tuesday, 9 February 2021 from 13.30h to 15.00h CET. Please find the access details below. Best, Johanna --- Topic: Conference call No patents on seeds! Time: Feb 9, 2021 01:30 PM Amsterdam, Berlin, Rome, Stockholm, Vienna Join Zoom Meeting https://us02web.zoom.us/j/82629354500?pwd=eFRhejh5VDNvQTlDVkxiZUJRYjJtQT09 Meeting ID: 826 2935 4500 Passcode: 857104 One tap mobile +431206093072,,82629354500#,,,,*857104# Austria +4312535501,,82629354500#,,,,*857104# Austria Dial by your location +43 120 609 3072 Austria +43 12 535 501 Austria +43 12 535 502 Austria +43 670 309 0165 Austria +43 72 011 5988 Austria +32 2 788 0172 Belgium +32 2 788 0173 Belgium +32 1579 5132 Belgium +32 2 290 9360 Belgium +32 2 585 5574 Belgium +32 2 588 4188 Belgium +45 47 37 25 75 Denmark +45 89 88 37 88 Denmark +45 32 70 12 06 Denmark +45 32 71 31 57 Denmark +45 32 72 80 10 Denmark +45 32 72 80 11 Denmark +49 30 5679 5800 Germany +49 69 3807 9883 Germany +49 695 050 2596 Germany +49 69 7104 9922 Germany +31 20 241 0288 Netherlands +31 20 794 0854 Netherlands +31 20 794 6519 Netherlands +31 20 794 6520 Netherlands +31 20 794 7345 Netherlands +351 308 804 188 Portugal +351 308 810 988 Portugal +351 211 202 618 Portugal +41 43 210 71 08 Switzerland +41 44 529 92 72 Switzerland +41 22 591 00 05 Switzerland +41 22 591 01 56 Switzerland +41 31 528 09 88 Switzerland +41 43 210 70 42 Switzerland Find your local number: https://us02web.zoom.us/u/keu2WrjfA0 Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 8:50 AM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de <mailto:npos_2018@testbiotech.de> Subject: [Npos_2018] Conference Call February Dear all, please fill in the doodle for our next conference call in February until Sunday, 24 January evening. https://doodle.com/poll/kgr8rfudxcg9n9gt?utm_source=poll <https://doodle.com/poll/kgr8rfudxcg9n9gt?utm_source=poll&utm_medium=link> &utm_medium=link Thank you! Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed

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important: New date for meeting with EPO (with deadline)
by Christoph Then 02 Feb '21

02 Feb '21

dear all just received an new proposal for a meeting with the Vize President of EPO. Please come back to me till end of the week: *We are now pleased to be able to offer you a choice of dates for our next meeting, these are: 3rd, 4th 5th March, mornings, or 3rd, 5th March afternoons.* Thanks! Christoph

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Telefonkonferenz Deutsch, 8.2.2021
by Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org 01 Feb '21

01 Feb '21

[Conference call in German] Liebe Runde, die nächste deutsche Telefonkonferenz findet am MO, 8.2. von 13.30h 15.00h statt. Diesmal vor der englischen TK. Weiter unten die Zoom-Infos. Liebe Grüße, Johanna --- Thema: NPOS Telefonkonferenz Deutsch Uhrzeit: 8.Feb..2021 01:30 PM Amsterdam, Berlin, Rom, Stockholm, Wien Zoom-Meeting beitreten https://us02web.zoom.us/j/85239681301?pwd=d3V3TFZxQjVqZE45ZTJoNW5WaDdUZz09 Meeting-ID: 852 3968 1301 Kenncode: 659590 Schnelleinwahl mobil +43720115988,,85239681301#,,,,*659590# Österreich +431206093072,,85239681301#,,,,*659590# Österreich Einwahl nach aktuellem Standort +43 72 011 5988 Österreich +43 120 609 3072 Österreich +43 12 535 501 Österreich +43 12 535 502 Österreich +43 670 309 0165 Österreich +49 69 7104 9922 Deutschland +49 30 5679 5800 Deutschland +49 69 3807 9883 Deutschland +49 695 050 2596 Deutschland +41 44 529 92 72 Schweiz +41 22 591 00 05 Schweiz +41 22 591 01 56 Schweiz +41 31 528 09 88 Schweiz +41 43 210 70 42 Schweiz +41 43 210 71 08 Schweiz Ortseinwahl suchen: https://us02web.zoom.us/u/kdK3TyyqL8 Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed

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question on UP system and potential court case with open source software organisation
by Christoph Then 29 Jan '21

29 Jan '21

Dear all I received a message from the open source software community: They are asking if we (npos) in Germany would start a court case against the EU Unified Patent to come into force. It looks like they have attorneys and money, but no legal standing in front of the Court in Germany. I think we do not have time and ressources to do so, but if you are interested, let me know. Cheers Christoph

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Feedback on long-term strategy until 2 February
by Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org 27 Jan '21

27 Jan '21

Dear all, in preparation for our meeting of members I'd like to remind you to send me a feedback from your organisation in regard to our long-term strategy We ask you to prepare a short text (1/2 page) with the position of your organisation (How do you think that NPOS should move forward? What are the goals of your organisation in regard to the focus of NPOS? Would you like to continue working together? etc.). The texts will then be sent to the members with the documents for the meeting so that we can then discuss further at the meeting. I am attaching the draft document for the strategy again. Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2021 8:27 AM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de Subject: [Npos_2018] Minutes Conference call 14 January 2021 Dear all, please find attached the minutes of our conference call from 14 January 2021. The most important points: 1.) In order to prepare our discussion at the Meeting of Members of our long term strategy, we ask you to prepare a short text (1/2 page) with the position of your organisation (How do you think that NPOS should move forward? What are the goals of your organisation in regard to the focus of NPOS? Would you like to continue working together?). Please send your position to Johanna until 2 February. The texts will then be sent to the members with the documents for the meeting. I am attaching the draft document for the strategy again. 2.) It was brought to our attention that the decision to start a petition was not clearly communicated at the end of last year. We apologize for that. We hope you still support the petition since it is one of our tools for this year's strategy. Update: WeMove approached us yesterday. They want to support our petition/campaign on a European level. 3.) Please find attached the draft press release (in German) for the Melon patent case as prepared by ARCHE NOAH. Please do not circulate! Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2021 10:32 AM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de <mailto:npos_2018@testbiotech.de> Subject: [Npos_2018] Conference call January Dear all, I wish you all a happy new year! I hope you enjoyed the holidays! Please find below the agenda for tomorrow's conference call. You can find the Zoom info in the email below. Attached a draft for our long term strategy as a basis for our discussion at the Meeting of Members. 1. Updates 1.1. Updates from the countries / organisations 1.2. Update on meetings with countries 2. Strategy / Next steps 2.1. The petition 2.2. Germany: Patent conference (June 2021), open letter to German ministry / public action? 2.3. Melon patent 2.4. other steps? 2.5. Long term strategy to be discussed at Meeting of Members - see draft document attached 3. Other 3.1. Communication from NPOS to members / make email list easier to handle for more passive members (Proposal from SWISSAID) 3.2. Next conference call Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Tuesday, December 8, 2020 4:52 PM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de <mailto:npos_2018@testbiotech.de> Subject: [Npos_2018] Conference call January Dear all, our next conference call will be on Thursday, 14 January 2021 from 10.30h to 12.00h. Please find the Zoom info below. We will as well organise a conference call in German. Best, Johanna --- Topic: Conference call No patents on seeds! Time: Jan 14, 2021 10:30 AM Amsterdam, Berlin, Rome, Stockholm, Vienna Join Zoom Meeting https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89985361852?pwd=dTNqQWt4VjlvRVlZNy96Qzl3K0k0dz09 Meeting ID: 899 8536 1852 Passcode: 326966 One tap mobile +436703090165,,89985361852#,,,,,,0#,,326966# Austria +43720115988,,89985361852#,,,,,,0#,,326966# Austria Dial by your location +43 670 309 0165 Austria +43 72 011 5988 Austria +43 120 609 3072 Austria +43 12 535 501 Austria +43 12 535 502 Austria +32 2 585 5574 Belgium +32 2 588 4188 Belgium +32 2 788 0172 Belgium +32 2 788 0173 Belgium +32 1579 5132 Belgium +32 2 290 9360 Belgium +45 32 72 80 10 Denmark +45 32 72 80 11 Denmark +45 47 37 25 75 Denmark +45 89 88 37 88 Denmark +45 32 70 12 06 Denmark +45 32 71 31 57 Denmark +49 30 5679 5800 Germany +49 69 3807 9883 Germany +49 695 050 2596 Germany +49 69 7104 9922 Germany +31 20 794 6520 Netherlands +31 20 794 7345 Netherlands +31 20 241 0288 Netherlands +31 20 794 0854 Netherlands +31 20 794 6519 Netherlands +351 308 810 988 Portugal +351 211 202 618 Portugal +351 308 804 188 Portugal +41 31 528 09 88 Switzerland +41 43 210 70 42 Switzerland +41 43 210 71 08 Switzerland +41 44 529 92 72 Switzerland +41 22 591 00 05 Switzerland +41 22 591 01 56 Switzerland Find your local number: https://us02web.zoom.us/u/kb75sp2IUN Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed From: Npos_2018 [mailto:npos_2018-bounces@testbiotech.de] On Behalf Of Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org Sent: Monday, November 30, 2020 5:06 PM To: npos_2018(a)testbiotech.de <mailto:npos_2018@testbiotech.de> Subject: [Npos_2018] Conference call January Dear all, please fill in the doodle for our conference call in January until Monday, 7 December, evening: https://doodle.com/poll/ffmcd5s2rw6twh2h?utm_source=poll <https://doodle.com/poll/ffmcd5s2rw6twh2h?utm_source=poll&utm_medium=link> &utm_medium=link Thank you! Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed

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! a question on the screaming vegetables (with a deadline for decision making)
by Christoph Then 26 Jan '21

26 Jan '21

Dear all so far, we produced three tomatoes and three broccolis. If there is interest from your side to have your own screaming veggies (to run public activities) we could produce additional ones at reasonable costs. For example, it would be great if we could run some activities at the same day in several countries. If we do not need more of these sculptures, the hardware to produce the veggies will be destroyed. After that it would become much more expensive to reproduce them. I asked the artist to wait with the decision till we have had our meeting. If there is interest, I can ask the artist on costs per sculpture and then we can take a decision. cheers Christoph

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DECISION: Partner of Open Source Seeds
by Johanna Eckhardt no-patents-seeds.org 25 Jan '21

25 Jan '21

Dear all, Open Source Seeds asked us if they can name us as partners on their homepage <https://www.opensourceseeds.org/> (see partners at the bottom). Although we have different strategies / positions, we cooperate and they usually support our activities – such as our current petition. So we would agree to be cited as partners. In case you want to veto that, please let us know until the end of the week (29 January). Best, Johanna Johanna ECKHARDT Project Coordination Tel. +43 680 21 26 343 <mailto:johanna.eckhardt@no-patents-on-seeds.org> johanna.eckhardt(a)no-patents-on-seeds.org NO PATENTS ON SEEDS! <http://www.no-patents-on-seeds.org/> www.no-patents-on-seeds.org <http://www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds> www.facebook.com/nopatentsonseeds <http://www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed> www.twitter.com/nopatentsonseed

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